AmourShipping (Ash x Serena) Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

PokemonTrainerY wrote:

I'd call that being neutral. He's just defining what 'date' means, be it romantic or not. So let's just turn our optimism down...

We can't really compare an anime to real world stuff. Also, dating =/= hanging out.

Who said anything about comparing?

And yes. The game doesn't affect the anime whatsoever. Time for a new topic:

Do you think Eureka will start noticing Serena's affection towards Satoshi during the Miare gym battle?

A random a** question just popped up in my kind. Nonetheless, discuss.

pokesrini wrote:I definitely agree with you Virgo. The dynamic they share, considering the number of episodes they got with each other is very very good. In fact, the bond that Ash and Serena have is probably on par with the bond that Ash and May/Ash and Dawn shared already! And they got few episodes with each other if you actually think about it.

We got a strange amount of fillers and only three Ash and Serena development episodes for some reason. It seems that Serena didn't really even have to bond with Ash, that the bond was somehow already there, after only two days, one night, and one (and a half) Gym battle. Perhaps it means that Ash and Serena are "meant for each other" because their personalities just mesh so naturally. Or maybe the writers are lazy...

I actually first realized this because I was on the Pearl Vault. Some of them were complaining that Dawn had to bond with Ash to even stop bickering, and they were mad that Serena just got to swoop in and be all lovey-dovey with him effortlessly.

@mathew14 I think that Bonnie might, since many people consider Lumiose to be the turning point of XY, when the plot will finally thicken.

taeuknam Well I suppose it was just a showcase of how natural a bond they seem to share? That they are just comfortable with each other; and don't really need much development as such. Now the reason Dawn and the others had it different was that they were strangers to Ash. But the thing is, when you see a person who you knew and had a good time with years ago in a land where you practically know no one else; and that person supports you so much, you tend to sort of connect with him/her easily. 

I think that explains Ash's and Serena's close bond; despite having few episodes regarding their development with each other. Now if Ash started developing romantic feelings for her at this point (XY054), it wouldn't make much sense. But after that, if the events of the episode are compelling enough to get him thinking, then it would be fine.

matthew11 I had actually speculated that Bonnie would catch hints of Serena's feelings in the Courmarine Gym. I think that Bonnie might know for sure after the Lumiose gym battle. Probably because of Serena's worry for Ash? Or maybe she whispers something in support; and Bonnie hears it?

matthew11 wrote:Do you think Eureka will start noticing Serena's affection towards Satoshi during the Miare gym battle?

It's definitely possible. It's hard to say whether Bonnie is going to root exclusively for Clemont or if she'll wish them both good luck like she did the first time they battled. I'm inclined to say the latter is more likely, in which case she'd probably notice and comment on the fact that Serena is only rooting for Ash.

taeuknam wrote:

pokesrini wrote:I definitely agree with you Virgo. The dynamic they share, considering the number of episodes they got with each other is very very good. In fact, the bond that Ash and Serena have is probably on par with the bond that Ash and May/Ash and Dawn shared already! And they got few episodes with each other if you actually think about it.

We got a strange amount of fillers and only three Ash and Serena development episodes for some reason. It seems that Serena didn't really even have to bond with Ash, that the bond was somehow already there, after only two days, one night, and one (and a half) Gym battle. Perhaps it means that Ash and Serena are "meant for each other" because their personalities just mesh so naturally. Or maybe the writers are lazy...

I actually first realized this because I was on the Pearl Vault. Some of them were complaining that Dawn had to bond with Ash to even stop bickering, and they were mad that Serena just got to swoop in and be all lovey-dovey with him effortlessly.

@mathew14 I think that Bonnie might, since many people consider Lumiose to be the turning point of XY, when the plot will finally thicken.

I wouldn't say it's because they're meant for each other, because the bond isn't about personalities meshing well so much as it's spending time together and getting to know and understand each other better. But also, I'm reminded of our "writers' hints." You know how sometimes (progressively more frequently as of late) they'll be shown standing or sitting next to each other in group scenes, sometimes conversing in the background? I believe there was one time in the Dedenne/Pichu switcheroo episode where Ash was standing with Clemont and Serena and talking directly to Serena? I'm sure that kind of thing happens all the time off-screen, and I doubt Clemont is always there. They probably have loads of little conversations like that.

I hope those people are right about the plot thickening...maybe that'll start around XY058, come to think of it

The plot has been thickening ever since XY040 IMO. Serena getting her new dream; and everything relating to it, Clemont catching a Luxio, Froakie evolving to Frogadier, Ash catching Goomy, the Courmarine Gym, the date, the debut...the Power Plant will definitely have something interesting.

You know, now that there have been mentions of the Parfum Palace episode, I feel that it was one of the more underrated episodes. I actually liked it quite a lot. In general, the fillers of XY have been fantastic. The only filler that was disappointing was the Wigglytuff vs. Salamence.

pokesrini wrote:The plot has been thickening ever since XY040 IMO. Serena getting her new dream; and everything relating to it, Clemont catching a Luxio, Froakie evolving to Frogadier, Ash catching Goomy, the Courmarine Gym, the date, the debut...the Power Plant will definitely have something interesting.

You know, now that there have been mentions of the Parfum Palace episode, I feel that it was one of the more underrated episodes. I actually liked it quite a lot. In general, the fillers of XY have been fantastic. The only filler that was disappointing was the Wigglytuff vs. Salamence.

Good point. I'm looking at you, Team Flare ._.

I liked that one as well. I think the only ones I didn't like were the Furfrou one, shiny Magikarp, and yeah, Wigglytuff. Wasn't a huge fan of the first ninja episode either, although it technically wasn't filler.

matthew11 wrote:

PokemonTrainerY wrote:

I'd call that being neutral. He's just defining what 'date' means, be it romantic or not. So let's just turn our optimism down...

We can't really compare an anime to real world stuff. Also, dating =/= hanging out.

Who said anything about comparing?

He was defining what date in real world means, so....

And yes. The game doesn't affect the anime whatsoever.

The mainstream Pokémon games always affects the anime.

Time for a new topic:

Do you think Eureka will start noticing Serena's affection towards Satoshi during the Miare gym battle?

I don't think Bonnie will notice. She's more interested in finding a wife for her brother.

PokemonTrainerY wrote:

matthew11 wrote:

PokemonTrainerY wrote:

I'd call that being neutral. He's just defining what 'date' means, be it romantic or not. So let's just turn our optimism down...

We can't really compare an anime to real world stuff. Also, dating =/= hanging out.

Who said anything about comparing?

He was defining what date in real world means, so....

And yes. The game doesn't affect the anime whatsoever.

The mainstream Pokémon games always affects the anime.

Time for a new topic:

Do you think Eureka will start noticing Serena's affection towards Satoshi during the Miare gym battle?

I don't think Bonnie will notice. She's more interested in finding a wife for her brother.

Nope. He is generally defining what date means in regards to XY059's description.

In some ways it does. But it doesn't affect amour... Yet, to say the least.

With all due respect, I'm gonna have to disagree with you there. While yes it is true she is more interested in finding a wife for his brother, Eureka seems more 'educated' with romance than his brother or any other characters other than Takeshi and some characters. And she can be a potential tease in a later ep. It was a let down that Grace didn't do it though. And who's being pessimistic now?

matthew11 wrote:
Nope. He is generally defining what date means in regards to XY059's description.

Is that so? But still, defining what a 'date' was kinda unnecessary here. Friends who aren't romantically interested in each other won't normally count hanging out as a 'date'. However, Serena IS romantically interested in Ash so the shopping trip might be a 'date' according to her.

I guess we'll have wait until the episode airs. Who knows, maybe Ash and Serena will end up going on a one-sided romantic date (without Ash realizing it) after the shopping trip.

In some ways it does. But it doesn't affect amour... Yet, to say the least.

Yeah.

With all due respect, I'm gonna have to disagree with you there. While yes it is true she is more interested in finding a wife for his brother, Eureka seems more 'educated' with romance than his brother or any other characters other than Takeshi and some characters. And she can be a potential tease in a later ep. It was a let down that Grace didn't do it though. And who's being pessimistic now?

If she's really that 'educated' in romance, she would've noticed Serena's crush by now. Besides, I don't want anyone to play matchmaker for Ash and Serena. I think It'd be better if Ash starts liking Serena without anyone pushing him to do it.

PokemonTrainerY wrote:

matthew11 wrote:
Nope. He is generally defining what date means in regards to XY059's description.

Is that so? But still, defining what a 'date' was kinda unecessary here. Friends who aren't romantically interested in each other won't normally count hanging out as a 'date'. However, Serena IS romantically interested in Ash so the shopping trip might be a 'date' according to her.

I guess we'll have wait until the episode airs. Who knows, maybe Ash and Serena will end up going on a one-sided romantic date (without Ash realizing it) after the shopping trip.

In some ways it does. But it doesn't affect amour... Yet, to say the least.

Yeah.

With all due respect, I'm gonna have to disagree with you there. While yes it is true she is more interested in finding a wife for his brother, Eureka seems more 'educated' with romance than his brother or any other characters other than Takeshi and some characters. And she can be a potential tease in a later ep. It was a let down that Grace didn't do it though. And who's being pessimistic now?

If she's really that 'educated' in romance, she would've noticed Serena's crush by now. Besides, I don't want anyone to play matchmaker for Ash and Serena. I think It'd be better if Ash starts liking Serena without anyone pushing him to do it.

That's your take. I am only defending my bro asuna. But let me tell you this; date means differently from other people's perspectives, so just respect them.

A little patience would be better, huh? Again, that is you expectations. I too am with you there, that amour needs no push from everyone. But that is solely relying on Satoshi generating hints on his own. I don't think he's gonna like her without help from outside. You know, you kinda remind me of Lorde.

matthew11 wrote:

PokemonTrainerY wrote:

matthew11 wrote:
Nope. He is generally defining what date means in regards to XY059's description.

Is that so? But still, defining what a 'date' was kinda unecessary here. Friends who aren't romantically interested in each other won't normally count hanging out as a 'date'. However, Serena IS romantically interested in Ash so the shopping trip might be a 'date' according to her.

I guess we'll have wait until the episode airs. Who knows, maybe Ash and Serena will end up going on a one-sided romantic date (without Ash realizing it) after the shopping trip.

In some ways it does. But it doesn't affect amour... Yet, to say the least.

Yeah.

With all due respect, I'm gonna have to disagree with you there. While yes it is true she is more interested in finding a wife for his brother, Eureka seems more 'educated' with romance than his brother or any other characters other than Takeshi and some characters. And she can be a potential tease in a later ep. It was a let down that Grace didn't do it though. And who's being pessimistic now?

If she's really that 'educated' in romance, she would've noticed Serena's crush by now. Besides, I don't want anyone to play matchmaker for Ash and Serena. I think It'd be better if Ash starts liking Serena without anyone pushing him to do it.

That's your take. I am only defending my bro asuna. But let me tell you this; date means differently from other people's perspectives, so just respect them.

A little patience would be better, huh? Again, that is you expectations. I too am with you there, that amour needs no push from everyone. But that is solely relying on Satoshi generating hints on his own. I don't think he's gonna like her without help from outside. You know, you kinda remind me of Lorde.

Satoshi may develop feelings for Serena and he will. But he's gonna need outside help to make him aware of what he's feeling. Atleast he needs confirmation from an external source!

Why Lorde btw? May I know?

Alright break it up. One of the teams here is gonna be proven wrong; or neither side will. All said and done, I feel that the "date" part is for our reference. This episode just seems like a date for the two. neither of them feels that it is one. All that I care about is that there will be some quality interactions between the two, possibly seeing Ash's armour of obliviousness cracking; even if just a little, and us getting a good hint or two from him that would suggest that he might develop feelings in future, however long.

We have put our points across there. Now let's just wait and see who is right; if anyone is.

As to Bonnie being more educated about romance, I side with matthew11. I'll give you the reason why PokemonTrainerY: Bonnie definitely knows more about romance than her brother does. That's one of the main reasons she looks for a "keeper" for Clemont. Now why didn't she recognize that Serena has feelings for Ash? Because Serena never showed any hints of it as far as Bonnie is concerned- except for that one instance in the Cyllage Gym. Bonnie did notice that it was strange, but then it was a one off thing. If it recurs let's say, in the Courmarine and/or Lumiose Gym battle(s), then she might pick it up. But as of now, the same argument we give for Ash not recognizing any hints given by Serena can be applied in Bonnie's case.

Amour256 wrote:

matthew11 wrote:

PokemonTrainerY wrote:

matthew11 wrote:
Nope. He is generally defining what date means in regards to XY059's description.

Is that so? But still, defining what a 'date' was kinda unecessary here. Friends who aren't romantically interested in each other won't normally count hanging out as a 'date'. However, Serena IS romantically interested in Ash so the shopping trip might be a 'date' according to her.

I guess we'll have wait until the episode airs. Who knows, maybe Ash and Serena will end up going on a one-sided romantic date (without Ash realizing it) after the shopping trip.

In some ways it does. But it doesn't affect amour... Yet, to say the least.

Yeah.

With all due respect, I'm gonna have to disagree with you there. While yes it is true she is more interested in finding a wife for his brother, Eureka seems more 'educated' with romance than his brother or any other characters other than Takeshi and some characters. And she can be a potential tease in a later ep. It was a let down that Grace didn't do it though. And who's being pessimistic now?

If she's really that 'educated' in romance, she would've noticed Serena's crush by now. Besides, I don't want anyone to play matchmaker for Ash and Serena. I think It'd be better if Ash starts liking Serena without anyone pushing him to do it.

That's your take. I am only defending my bro asuna. But let me tell you this; date means differently from other people's perspectives, so just respect them.

A little patience would be better, huh? Again, that is you expectations. I too am with you there, that amour needs no push from everyone. But that is solely relying on Satoshi generating hints on his own. I don't think he's gonna like her without help from outside. You know, you kinda remind me of Lorde.

Satoshi may develop feelings for Serena and he will. But he's gonna need outside help to make him aware of what he's feeling. Atleast he needs confirmation from an external source!

Why Lorde btw? May I know?

There you go! Nice and powerful 2 vs 1.

Lorde because she seems fixated on her idea about amour not needing any push from outside. While it does seem pessimistic, I'd call that being neutral also.

And judicator pokesrini, may you now announce who the winner of this debate is?

This is nobody vs nobody. C'mon kids, break it up -_-

P.S. I think Ash may not need anybody's help to realize his feelings for Serena, but he will need someone to help him deal with them.

matthew11 No one. This is just an articulation of each person's own opinions and speculations on what we would potentially see in the date episode. There is no winner or loser for that. There is no objective criteria to declare a winner here.

BloodRed Someone..or some event

Next topic: Apart from the episodes from XY058-XY060, do you expect any hints from the episodes that have been announced so far? If yes, in which episodes? And in each case, articulate what you expect to see.

pokesrini. Dammit. Ah well, true. Opinions fly everywhere though, and not concrete facts.

As to the question, I think the question is too vague. But meh

As usual, I'm gonna a expect the classical worry hint from Serena in the Team Flare arc, but not just any subtle worry though. You get the picture. And, as always, I expect some from Satoshi. A little subtle hint wouldn't really hurt though. < (this was for a different question edited by pokesrini)

As to the new question, looking onto the images and descriptions. I think, none.

matthew11 Forgive the wording of my question. I have modified it accordingly.

As for me, I expect some minor hints in the first Goomy episode- which seems an Ash focused one, and the Vanillite episode. Btw, it seems like Goomy liked to suck on Serena's ear (damn that is so wrong).

The first Goomy episode may see some concern from Serena when goomy falls on Ash's head straight. (why does Goomy fall from the sky anyway?) The Vanillite, I like to believe that Ash would at least check on Serena to see if she isn't feeling too cold

As an answer to pokesrini's question, I have one small thing to remind you of:
Ash takes an attack meant for Numera in the upcoming episode. That's where I expect to see a hint or two.

Oh? Is that so? I'm sure that would yield a hint or two- namely concern from Serena's side. However that would be dismissed easily by many others saying that even Bonnie and Clemont showed some concern. Serena will be the only one shouting out, "Satoshi!" and Clemont and Bonnie would just exclaim in shock.

I'd like to make one last post in the old topic.

matthew11 wrote:

That's your take. I am only defending my bro asuna. But let me tell you this; date means differently from other people's perspectives, so just respect them.

Gotta love the brotherly love.

I wasn't intending disrespect it to begin with. I was just pointing out that dating and hanging out aren't the same.

A little patience would be better, huh?

Patience? Ok, let's wait for another 50+ episode to come out to see if Bonnie tries to hook Serena up with Ash or not?

Again, that is you expectations. I too am with you there, that amour needs no push from everyone. But that is solely relying on Satoshi generating hints on his own. I don't think he's gonna like her without help from outside. You know, you kinda remind me of Lorde.

Hey look, I'm Lorde in disguise!

Sarcasm aside, Serena herself could make Ash fall for her. It's much better than someone else pushing Ash to like Serena. I don't really think Bonnie cares about playing cupid for anyone besides Clemont.

Amour256 wrote:Satoshi may develop feelings for Serena and he will. But he's gonna need outside help to make him aware of what he's feeling. Atleast he needs confirmation from an external source!

And what if Serena is the one who makes him aware of it? There's no need for somebody else to play matchmaker if Serena herself makes Ash fall for her.

matthew11 wrote:There you go! Nice and powerful 2 vs 1.

*sigh*

Really?

Lorde because she seems fixated on her idea about amour not needing any push from outside.

Wow, what a coincidence. >_>

While it does seem pessimistic, I'd call that being neutral also.

That's your take. It's not really pessimistic or neutral or whatever. I just don't want anyone to interfere Ash and Serena's romantic development, that's all.

And judicator pokesrini, may you now announce who the winner of this debate is?

No one.

pokesrini wrote:
Next topic: Apart from the episodes from XY058-XY060, do you expect any hints from the episodes that have been announced so far? If yes, in which episodes? And in each case, articulate what you expect to see.

Maybe there will be some worry hints from Serena's side in XY056 since Ash ends up getting separated from the group in the episode.

matthew11 wrote:If it's necessary, then your arguments are null and void.

Just like your arguments.

:->

PokemonTrainerY wrote:I'd like to make one last post in the old topic.

matthew11 wrote:

That's your take. I am only defending my bro asuna. But let me tell you this; date means differently from other people's perspectives, so just respect them.

Gotta love the brotherly love.

I wasn't intending disrespect it to begin with. I was just pointing out that dating and hanging out aren't the same.

A little patience would be better, huh?

Patience? Ok, let's wait for another 50+ episode to come out to see Bonnie tries to hook Serena up with Ash or not?

Again, that is you expectations. I too am with you there, that amour needs no push from everyone. But that is solely relying on Satoshi generating hints on his own. I don't think he's gonna like her without help from outside. You know, you kinda remind me of Lorde.

Hey look, I'm Lorde in disguise!

Sarcasm aside, Serena herself could make Ash fall for her. It'd much better than someone else pushing Ash. I don't really think Bonnie cares about playing cupid for anyone besides Clemont.

Amour256 wrote:Satoshi may develop feelings for Serena and he will. But he's gonna need outside help to make him aware of what he's feeling. Atleast he needs confirmation from an external source!

And what if Serena is the one who makes him aware of it? There's no need for somebody else to play matchmaker if Serena herself makes Ash fall for her.

matthew11 wrote:There you go! Nice and powerful 2 vs 1.

*sigh*

Really?

Lorde because she seems fixated on her idea about amour not needing any push from outside.

Wow, what a coincidence. >_>

While it does seem pessimistic, I'd call that being neutral also.

That's your take. It's not really pessimistic or neutral or whatever. I just don't want anyone to interfere Ash and Serena's romantic development, that's all.

And judicator pokesrini, may you now announce who the winner of this debate is?

No one.

pokesrini wrote:
Next topic: Apart from the episodes from XY058-XY060, do you expect any hints from the episodes that have been announced so far? If yes, in which episodes? And in each case, articulate what you expect to see.

Maybe there will be some worry hints from Serena's side in XY056 since Ash ends up getting separated from the group in the episode.

I know right? Well that's your own definition, so no harm done.

If that's what you want, then I'm not gonna stop you from waiting then. That's not a problem for me.

That's your take, again.

If it's necessary, then your arguments are null and void.

Blood Red wrote:This is nobody vs nobody. C'mon kids, break it up -_-

P.S. I think Ash may not need anybody's help to realize his feelings for Serena, but he will need someone to help him deal with them.

Dammit! Where is Brock when you need him? I think a little push wouldn't hurt. Something like "Is she your Girlfriend?" kind of tease and leave him figuring things out for himself.

PokemonTrainerY wrote:

pokesrini wrote:
Next topic: Apart from the episodes from XY058-XY060, do you expect any hints from the episodes that have been announced so far? If yes, in which episodes? And in each case, articulate what you expect to see.

I guess I'll take my lists of hints out for this one.

Now where should I start?

Goomy episodes:
Serena's hints
-Worrying for Ash
- Calling out Ash's name a lot of times

Ash's hints:
-Ash supporting and being a gentleman like always
- Ash protecting Serena

Writer's hints:
-Separating Ash and Serena from the blonde siblings
- Goomy thinking that Ash and Serena are its parents or something

Animator's hints
- The casual we're standing/sitting/eating next to each other most of the time kind of hint

Episode 57:
Serena hints: NA
Ash's Hints: NA
Writer's hints: NA
Animator's hints:
The casual we're standing/sitting/eating next to each other most of the time kind of hint

Welp, that's it for my list. :/


As for the "Date", it could be anything. Perhaps it is an actual date. Serena directly asked Ash out on a date to buy those presents and Ash is aware that they are on a "date". Perhaps it's one-sided. Ash asked Serena to go with him on a shopping since he has little to no experience about it. Serena then interpreted it as a "Date". Perhaps it is a date on the viewers/writer's POV. Perhaps the title "date" is actually just a teasing. It could be that it's only a normal shopping for the two of them but then, there are a lot of cute moments to the point that it actually became a "date".

Now for Bonnie's case, will she actually become a matchmaker for these two? In a realsitic view, I'd say no. She's far too busy for her own brother. Interesting view, maybe Bonnie will try to encourage Serena more and more. Perhaps she will talk to her brother to ask Ash how he feels about Serena.

Now back to the date. Well date can be anything. It can be between two lovers, Between two friends, date with your father, with your mother, with your brother/sister, etc. Well, that's how it is in real life. However in Japan, or more accurately, in Anime, date is the real deal, like really, a date is a date.

Anyway guys, give it a rest. I like Asuna's neutral points but PokemonTrainerY also makes a good sense as well.

So I'm planning to write a fanfic where Serena travels to Sinnoh alone after the XY group breaks up at the end of XY to practice her showcase skills and compete in Showcases. She'll then run into Dawn and the 2 will travel together. They'll then meet Ash later on while Ash is taking on the Sinnoh Battle Frontier. I think I will include amour hints in this fic even though romance isn't really my style. So what do you guys think?

My answer will suit to this thread.
Amour hints are always welcomed. When I read fanfics, I expect something between Ash and Serena.
Question: Do you think, bringing Ash's old Pokémon might bring amour closer to canon? I mean could it trigger Ash telling his stories, companions, he used to travel with, etc.

Serena: Hey Ash! I'm pregnant, you're the father!
Ash: NOPE NOPE NOPE NOPE NOPE NOPE NOPE

Every time I see this, it never fails to make me laugh
So yeah caption this picture (amour-style of course)